Wool

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Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:24 am

Some materials work very well indeed for me on some flies, ( mohair is one of them, I would not like to be without it, I consider it far more useful than seal fur although I have quite a selection of that too! :) ), I also have a fairly large collection of stuff which I hardly or never use any more. If I had known when I obtained it what I know now I would not have bothered with at least ninety percent of it at all. Nowadays I tend to ignore a lot of fairly exotic stuff altogether. It might work, but it is not likely to be any better than stuff I already use and it is a lot of work testing new stuff.

Even if somebody actually did produce some "magic" material that worked every time, I would not buy any, as in that case most of the fun would be gone for me.
daringduffer
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Re: Wool

Post by daringduffer » Fri Feb 15, 2013 2:17 pm

"Mike Connor wrote"

One of the most used and successful blends is bright yellow mohair with hare's ear but there are many more.
Last night I prepared a dubbing mix consisting of hare's ear and bright yellow mohair, the latter from our member Bill Bailey. He calls it "Superfine mohair" and so it is; super fine and super beautiful. I'm sure quite a few members know of his excellent dyeing work, using the old methods.
I also tied a couple of flies with that mix and the fish are in for a real surprise this up-coming season. Mike; what proportions are recommended for this mix, either from literature or from your own experience?

dd

I googled and found this example:http://books.google.se/books?id=NPM-AAA ... ir&f=false
Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:35 pm

That varies a lot, some authors give proportions for various flies, many changed the proportions or even the colours as the season progressed. Their aim was always to match the insect colours as closely as they could. No one mix will suit for everything. For a couple of early season flies I use a mix of about five pinches of bright yellow adult mohair, ( "kid" mohair tends to be a bit soft for some things),cut in various lengths, from about 3/8" to 5/8". to about 20 pinches of mixed hare body fur from the back of a dark jack hare. I usually cut the bunches I want with scissors as I mostly want guard hair, but you can shear it if you set the clippers up right. The size of the pinches is not important as long as it is consistent. I put this through an electric blender to make sure it is well mixed, but water blending also works well and is probably the better method. You can check your colours at the same time. This works well for a few flies on the rivers I fish. You may need to adjust it to suit the flies on your rivers. You only need very small amounts of coloured mohair in some blends other blends may use as as much as 50% mohair or more. It is mostly blended with various furs. Some also "graduated" the colours of bodies to suit, this is more difficult to do.Many Irish dressers did this ( Scots as well, in fact a lot did) and soem still do. This is done by mixing very small amunts in the fingers and takes some practice but makes first class flies when you get it right.

You can find some blends and proportions here;

http://archive.org/stream/flyfishentomo ... 0/mode/2up

and there are a lot more in quite a few of the older books

This makes some flies better when used properly, but it is not "Magic". Most blends will work much better than single colours anyway, especially with fur having broken colours like hare fur, squirrel, and some others, but of course it works best if the overall colour is a good match for whatever insect you are trying to imitate.

I have a list somewhere of various blends which have worked well for me on a few things. I will try and find it and post it for you. But, as I wrote, you really need to make your own according to whatever you are trying to imitate.

The yellow mohair with hare's ear ( usually dark) was popular with quite a few authors. It has also worked well for me in various proportions. I do a lot of this according to "feel" and looking for a colour blend I know I don't measure a lot any more, I know what I am aiming for in most cases.
daringduffer
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Re: Wool

Post by daringduffer » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:59 pm

Thank you for the reply. Adjusting for the imitation intended makes sense but it is always interesting to know how other people do.
You put me onto the use of the use of black and white in colour mixtures. The effect of this had not occured to me until then. If you find your list I would be happy to see it.

dd
Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 5:38 pm

Some "generic" blends which work well on some flies you can darken or lighten the blend with various furs, depending on what you are trying to achieve;

Donegal olive ( a popular Irish blend used on various flies);
equal parts of , Green, Bright Yellow, Scarlet, Light Blue, Golden Olive, Orange. You can add hare fur to this as well.

Sooty Olive. Dark olive mohair blended with dark brown hare fur ( or other fur).

Irish Claret. Made from mohair or seal fur using blends of scarlet and purple, sometimes black or brown may be added.

Killerbug blend;

Here is a pattern and the mix:

Hook, size 16 to size 6 long shank!
Underbody 1. Lead wire, Overwound with thread, and varnished either with clear varnish to seal the lead before applying silver tinsel, or with the colour as desired, for the particular dressing. Here, Margaret Astor Diamant Red No. 488, which is a dark blood red. This simulates the original underbody of dark red copper wire, and I fancy is somewhat more effective. One may also use orange or other red shades as well.

Underbody2. Silver lurex. Best over the "damp" varnish.
Body. Dubbing made of the following mixture *.
Rib. gold (brass) wire.

*
Add two pinches of teal blue mohair, dyed hare belly fur (or soft seals fur), one pinch of hot orange mohair, hare fur (or soft seal fur), two pinches of white antron, one pinch of clear antron, and one pinch of soft crimson mohair or crimson hare fur (or soft seal fur), to twenty pinches of pre-blended fawn hare body guard and underfur. Blend well so that the colours "disappear" in the general fawn colour.

The exact shade can be adjusted by using darker fur and other blending colours. One can obtain almost the exact shade of the 477 and its varying texture. Indeed, when corretcly mixed and tightly dubbed, one can not tell the difference, either dry or wet.

You can dub sparingly, keeping the fly slim, but still covering the lurex. Or you can dub a bit more heavily, and brush the fly to shape afterwards. The lead underbody must be varnished (nail polish) before winding the lurex and dubbing, as it will otherwise bleed and ruin the fly quite quickly. If you use the red varnish underbody, then leave out the crimson hare fur. The underbody must be completely dry before you dub or wind the body, and especially when using the red varnish underbody.

This rather weird purply brown colour ( the colour of the wool when wet over a copper or red varnished body) is very attractive to grayling, (and trout!), and they will actually pick it up off the bottom. The lurex is necessary to make it "shine" when wet. It will work with a white painted hookshank as well, if you prefer lighter flies, but it is most effective on the bottom. The lurex or white shank underbodies give different effects compared to the red / orange varnish underbody.

Doubtless there are other effective mixes, but this one works well. A version with a pinch each of bright green, bright yellow and dark red/brown dubbing added to ten pinches of hare body fur, over a white hook shank ( denso tape), works very well for trout in summer, and a version with white Antron mixed in the same hare dubbing (White, not transparent) works well as a shrimp pattern in the ocean.


( I will have to find my base list before I can finish this list)

Some blends you will already know, like "Tups" and a couple of others although there is a lot of discussion about it you can blend the "colour" very well using mohair and some furs.

I use a system on my containers like this;

Dubbing system

HB1/PYM1 = Harebody 1 Pale yellow mohair1 etc. This tells me how many pinches of what are in the mix. I aso label sme stuff according to the flies I am going to dress with it.

Hare fur itself has a lot of various colours and many dressers blended fur from various parts of the hare, some only using the mask and ears, to get the colours they wanted.

Just about any fly will work better when the body is blended correctly. For claret, it is better to mix several shades of claret, light, medium and dark, and perhaps some dark and some red hare fur or squirrel fur than use one shade. The blends per se are not particularly critical on some things but the blend itself makes a huge difference. Such flies invariably catch better than those made with single colours.

Some colours like fiery brown can be blended but the dye used on the base mohair ( or fur )is also important.Most modern dubbings give the correct reflected light colour but an incorrect transmitted light colour of auburn/ orangey brown. Some original patterns devised by Rogan of Ballyshannon used fur that had been stained in matured Jackass urine which gave it a warm yellowy glow when seen by transmitted light. A colour reminiscent of the yellow brown of an autumn leaf.

The only way to achieve that effect with modern dyes is to first dye the fur bright golden yellow then overdye it with a mix of gold and fiery brown.

You can use some fur blends to achieve this colour as well.

Very many dressers were well aware of the importance of translucence and transmitted light and took this inot account with their dubbing.

You may also find this of interest;

http://www.flyfishingnetwork.com/FFN/Cu ... 2Jack.html

I have a lot of information on this subject, some collected and a lot of my own, but I don't have access to all of it right now I will have to transfer some notes and data from some old backups before I can get at it. If I have time I will try to do that in the next few days.

Some flies work well at certain times with a specific blend of materials. I only use that blend for that fly. There are some "universal" or "generic" blends for some things as given above, but any given fly will only work best with the blend made for it, and using that blend on another fly is pointless. Many olives work a very great deal better when made with blended materials. The exact blend depends on the flies you want to imitate, and "graduated" body flies work best of all in most cases.
Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:00 pm

You can get the book you referenced here;

http://archive.org/search.php?query=The ... n%20angler

There are several editions. I have them all, but this one is good;

http://archive.org/details/northernangleror00kirkiala

Searching on "mohair" in that book turns up a lot of stuff;

http://archive.org/stream/northernangle ... rch/mohair

It is a good book generally in my opinion.
Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:28 pm

Yes, I have some synthetics and I do use some, but mostly I use natural materials. I have nothing against synthetics as such, I just don't know enough about them. I have been using natural materials for half a century and know how to get the best out of many of them for my purposes. I have no idea at all how to do that with a whole host of synthetics, and I no longer have the time, ( or if I am honest the inclination either),to learn. It takes a long time and a lot of work to learn these things sufficiently well to use them efficiently. Many of my occasional experiments with synthetics were not at all successful, but that was doubtless due as much as anything to my lack of knowledge on the matter.

There are people who use them and can probably give reasonable advice on them. I don't know enough to do so. I have tried a few things, notably blending some stuff with natural materials, but most of my results are inconclusive. I can't say that they are any better than the stuff I used before. Some might be, under certain circumstances, I just dont know. The main issue for me is that I can't see the point in using something else unless it is better in some way than the stuff I already use. I have not found anything that was noticeably better, and so there is no point in my using it, even if it is just as good. The only way to test these things is to try them out, and there is no way I could try even a small fraction of the materials now available so I tend to stick to what I know. It took me a long time to find out some things, and it would take a long time to find out about a lot of new stuff. I need flies I can rely on, and I can only rely on things I know.
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Re: Wool

Post by letumgo » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:36 pm

I'm enjoying the discussion of the Irish and Scottish dubbing blends. The graduated bodies sounds interesting too. Thanks Mike.
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Mike Connor

Re: Wool

Post by Mike Connor » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:17 pm

I knew a couple of people who did this and one guy who sold such flies. ( He was the one who actually taught me to do it).They were so effective for those who knew how to use them he could basically set his own price for them and he only dressed a limited number anyway. It is quite a few years now since I saw any like this.

Basically the flies were dressed in such a way that the body colours graduated from abdomen to thorax, which was often,but not always, darker. They were modeled on natural insects. His olives looked as if they could get up and fly away, but in contrast to many "exact imitation" flies nowadays they were first class fish catchers as well.

Hare fur was commonly used as there are a lot of colours/shades available on the animal. It takes quite a bit of practice to get this right and takes longer to do. The base silk colour was also important, although most were dressed using a lightish yellow colour. These flies often looked amazingly lifelike. The main trick is to have a selection of graded pinches set out and then choose tiny amounts from each pile to get the gradation required. Achieving consistent results requires a lot of practice. Sometimes other trace colours would also be blended in. A few red fibres in the abdomen for "veins" was often done. In some cases various other colours would be used at the tail to simulate egg balls. Many people still do this on various flies of course.

Such flies are more complex to dress and you need natural models or to know the insects very well indeed to be able to do it properly as well as being a bit of an artist and getting the colours right. I still do it for some flies but not very many because it takes me a lot longer to do it than a "standard" sort of fly. Also, I am fishing less and less nowadays for various reasons and I don't need many flies any more.
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Re: Wool

Post by William Anderson » Fri Feb 15, 2013 7:23 pm

letumgo wrote:I'm enjoying the discussion of the Irish and Scottish dubbing blends. The graduated bodies sounds interesting too. Thanks Mike.
Me too, and curse the lot of you! I had to run into an AC Moore for some large canvases for a couple painting projects, and before I could get to the art isle I had three skeins of wool blend yarns, they looked so great wool, worsted and mohair...sigh. More to share. =).

W
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