Lots to know

[whisperer]

Hi,
I have been looking over the site, and there is so much to absorb. Just a quick question. I have been reading the information on Gossamer thread. Is it difficult to tie with?

Thanks,
Ernie

[Ron Eagle Elk]

Whisperer,

I've been using Pearsall's Gossamer for years and find it as easy to tie with as most other threads. I do wax the silk to help hols materials in palce, or to change the color of the thread.

REE

[narcodog]

X2 what Ron said. I tie all of my s/h's with silk. The only problem you might have is if have ruff fingers. The silk will catch on ruff hands.

[letumgo]

It is not any harder to tye with silk, but there are a few more variables to keep in mind. The main challenges you face when tying with Pearsall's Gossamer silk are:

- Selecting a good bobbin to hold the smaller spools. I use a Wasatch ceramic bobbin specially designed for the narrow spools
- Gossamer silk has a larger diameter than regular tying thread, so bulk can be an issue around the head of the fly. Make each wrap count!
- Gossamer silk has a reverse twist, when compared with regular thread (Z-twist as apposed to an S-twist). Important to keep in mind if you intend to untwist the silk to insert dubbing between the strands.
- Silk becomes translucent when wet. The color of the underbody will affect the appearance of the fly when it is fished. Normal thread does not change color as much when it gets wet, or depending on the underlying color (hook shank, underbody, tinsel). It is important to keep this in mind if you are trying to match a specific insect color.
- Tying wax (Cobblers wax) is often used to improve the durability of the fly (keeps the silk from slipping around) and to adjust the color of the fly (darken the shade of the silk).

[CM_Stewart]

I prefer the Pearsall's Gossamer to any of the other threads I've used. The only problem I've had is with one spool of brown, which will break unexpectedly. I bought another spool but haven't tried it yet, so best guess is I got one bad spool. Decided to just tie gently and reinforce the thread by wrapping a starling feather around it.

[whisperer]

Thanks for the replies! My experience is tying mostly dry flies, some nymphs and streamers-a very few wet flies. I've never tied soft-hackles, so I guess it's time to try the silk. I will look into the Gossamer and the bobbin suggested. It should be an interesting trip.

Ernie

[letumgo]

Chris - I cracked up laughing when I read your comment about using starling for reinforcement. Good one!

[William Anderson]

Me too, now that's funny.

Tying with silk took me a bit to adjust to a couple years ago. I'm not the quickest study, but I did figure it out to some degree. The funny thing is after going through the regular progression of tying the finer and finer threads you get used to tying with 14/0 and counting wraps really doesn't make any difference. But when you start to tie with gossamer silk you really feel like you're trying to do the impossible with a piece of rope at first. I started asking a lot of questions and found that you get the best results if you count your wraps, and try to use the least possible to do the job. Unwrap the silk to tie on and to in the hackle (by the stem ) and then depending on what you are trying to achieve you'll want to wrap or unwrap the silk for each step.

For instance, if you're going to tie a more traditional soft-hackle with a silk body and game hackle, I unwrap the silk to tie on (three turns), and tie in the hackle as stated (two turns), with each wrap you'll have to watch to be sure you're not rewrapping or twisting the silk. when with the flattened silk and medium tension very smoothy bring the wraps, not overlapping, down toward the bend and at the point where you want the silk body to begin, twist the silk back to create a round rope shape (someone remind me how many twists that takes, I dont have my tying stuff out) and bring the wraps back toward the eye in touching turns creating a segmented silk body. Stop short of the hackle and bring the hackle back a couple full turns toward the bend. At this point almost fully unwrap the silk again to nearly flat and catch the hackle and cut up through the hackle in a turn to creat the eye. snip the hackle tip that is remaining behind your hackle wraps and unwind the silk completely flat before using your whip finishes to complete the fly (3-4 turns). If you try to tie off the head of the fly with the silk still roped...it will pile up.

And then...every person on this site does each of these steps differently and with contradictory advise, which is a bonus. Options are good. Just don't listen to anyone who tells you that you can tie in a hackle by the tip. That's just nonsense. (emoticon necessary here to signify intended humor and not to be misunderstood as an actual comment - although it's true.)

The body can be tied with flattened thread as well, allowing whatever is beneath it to show through more prominently.


.02 cents

w

[Otter]

Me too, now that's funny.

Tying with silk took me a bit to adjust to a couple years ago. I'm not the quickest study, but I did figure it out to some degree. The funny thing is after going through the regular progression of tying the finer and finer threads you get used to tying with 14/0 and counting wraps really doesn't make any difference. But when you start to tie with gossamer silk you really feel like you're trying to do the impossible with a piece of rope at first. I started asking a lot of questions and found that you get the best results if you count your wraps, and try to use the least possible to do the job. Unwrap the silk to tie on and to in the hackle (by the stem ) and then depending on what you are trying to achieve you'll want to wrap or unwrap the silk for each step.

For instance, if you're going to tie a more traditional soft-hackle with a silk body and game hackle, I unwrap the silk to tie on (three turns), and tie in the hackle as stated (two turns), with each wrap you'll have to watch to be sure you're not rewrapping or twisting the silk. when with the flattened silk and medium tension very smoothy bring the wraps, not overlapping, down toward the bend and at the point where you want the silk body to begin, twist the silk back to create a round rope shape (someone remind me how many twists that takes, I dont have my tying stuff out) and bring the wraps back toward the eye in touching turns creating a segmented silk body. Stop short of the hackle and bring the hackle back a couple full turns toward the bend. At this point almost fully unwrap the silk again to nearly flat and catch the hackle and cut up through the hackle in a turn to creat the eye. snip the hackle tip that is remaining behind your hackle wraps and unwind the silk completely flat before using your whip finishes to complete the fly (3-4 turns). If you try to tie off the head of the fly with the silk still roped...it will pile up.

And then...every person on this site does each of these steps differently and with contradictory advise, which is a bonus. Options are good. Just don't listen to anyone who tells you that you can tie in a hackle by the tip. That's just nonsense. (emoticon necessary here to signify intended humor and not to be misunderstood as an actual comment - although it's true.)

The body can be tied with flattened thread as well, allowing whatever is beneath it to show through more prominently.


.02 cents

w

Pretty much spot on and good advice , except for .....

I often tie hackles in by the tip - off course sometimes one needs to be a little gentler when doing so....

Heres an excellent scottish tier Davy McPhaail in action, well worth watching a few of his youtube videos for good tying techniques - he is a class act and by all accounts one of the good guys.

Hares Ear and Plover http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zR2QXRE ... re=related
and
Greenwells Wet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7akiUJm ... re=related
and
Snipe and Purple http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yj5kadOi ... re=channel
and
Trad Wet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0O9GJdRb ... re=channel

For his full list http://www.youtube.com/user/DavieMcPhail

Still your advice is pretty good.

Funny thing about gossamer is that when you first use it, you will hate it, but once you get the hang of it you will often reach for it and then go darn, i need to use ordinary tying thread for this type of fly.

[letumgo]

William - Excellent summary. I often find myself counting wraps and undoing wraps, when it is possible to do without compromising the durability of the fly. I would like to add a comment about the tying in hackle by the stem or tip. I find that if the feather has uniform thickness over the length (hungarian partridge for example) that will be wrapped, I prefer to tye the feather in by the stem. Some feathers, however, have a significant tapper (fine stem at the tip and very thick at the base). For these types of feathers (jackdaw for example), I get better results when I tye in the feather by the tip. That way I am not fighting the added bulk of the feathers stem.

In terms of your comment about thread twist, I would recommend getting a spool of Jasper silk. The degree of thread twist becomes very noticeable because of the orange & black strands.