FLYMPH FORUM

letumgo wrote: Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:14 pm In my experience, black Pearsall's silk has been a troublesome color. I had problems with thread breakage. The dying process may weaken the black Marabou silk.

I think that's long been the case. Ever notice how comparatively few patterns in Pritt or Edmunds/Lee call for black silk? Or wonder why Stewart's black spider calls for brown thread?

My understanding is that black was what they dyed their mistakes when trying for another color, so it was essentially processed twice.

Makes sense.

By the way, the other reason I stopped using black Pearsall's silk, was that I simply switched to regular thread. I figured I did not need to worry about body translucency as much with the black color thread, so I got away from using black silk. It would probably still be fine for dubbed bodies, or as ribbing.

I get using the silk to copy the original recipes... but what benefit does the silk provide over other materials.

ronr, Howdy;

ronr wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:57 am I get using the silk to copy the original recipes... but what benefit does the silk provide over other materials.

Translucence, subtle color shift when waxed ...

hank

Both spools of black that I have owned, purchased from different sources at different times, were so fragile that it would require the touch of a safe cracker to use them. Oh well, back to Uni 6/0 ...

ronr wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:57 am I get using the silk to copy the original recipes... but what benefit does the silk provide over other materials.

There really isn't much beyond staying traditional really. There is some translucent property when wet. Which I think can be important for thread bodied spiders which show a lot of thread color. For dubbed bodies I don't think it makes much difference. When making the pre-made bodies for flymphs, the silk is waxed before twisting the dubbing strand. The silk holds the twist much better than other threads. If you are not making pre-made strands I don't see a big enough benefit over other threads.

tie2fish wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 9:35 am Both spools of black that I have owned, purchased from different sources at different times, were so fragile that it would require the touch of a safe cracker to use them. Oh well, back to Uni 6/0 ...

I don't think that I've successfully tied a single fly with black silk without breaking it at least once. I gave trying years ago.

The reason black silk is so fragile is because it was dyed with logwood and iron. The iron is a metallic salt used as a mordant. Silk sutures are still dyed this way because this dye is natural. Just as iron turns to rust so too iron mordant corrodes the silk. At one time it actually was illegal in Europe to dye black this way. I once dyed some yarn using medieval dyes and methods for the Treatyse flies. The black yarn took three whole days so black was a very expensive color. It was worn by the clergy and other elites.

I really enjoy knowledge!

dd

Old Hat wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:43 pm

ronr wrote: Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:57 am I get using the silk to copy the original recipes... but what benefit does the silk provide over other materials.

There really isn't much beyond staying traditional really. There is some translucent property when wet. Which I think can be important for thread bodied spiders which show a lot of thread color. For dubbed bodies I don't think it makes much difference. When making the pre-made bodies for flymphs, the silk is waxed before twisting the dubbing strand. The silk holds the twist much better than other threads. If you are not making pre-made strands I don't see a big enough benefit over other threads.

thanks Carl... I've just received my order of wax and will be using silk to make some brushes...I've found the fish don't seem to know the difference between the silk bodies and thread bodies on my soft hackle...